9/23/Saturday Night
Demographic Information:
65
Male
Afula, Israel
1941
White
Jewish
Israeli
Socioeconomic: upper class
Jewish…moderately religious, conservative
MD from Hebrew University in Jerusalem 1968
Master of Science in Pediatric, University of
Tel Aviv 1974
Internship Baylon Hospital, 1969
Residency in Pediatric, Kaplan Hospital in
Rechovot Israel, 1969-74
Fellowship, UCLA, 1974-76 in Infectious Disease
Worked for a year in Fairview State Hospital,
California, 76-77, affiliated with U of Irvine
77-80: Children’s Hospital, Washington, DC;
staff of Infectious disease
80-present: U.S. Navy, Bethesda MD; Naval
Hospital; pediatric infectious disease and research in infectious disease
-Professor of Pediatric at Georgetown, since
1990
Military:
1980-Navy
1979-1981: Israeli army
After medical school, became reserve officer
physician, regiment of supply for the tanks
Fought in 2 wars; 1967- 6 day war, medic, had
not finished medical school yet, Jerusalem
1973- Yom Kippur War, with regiment (=600,
700 soldiers), Sinai, doctor of people doing supply, about 300 trucks
Family History:
Parents:
Father born in Austria in 1907, played soccer, and he
emigrated to Israel in 1933, worked as a welder in a factory, kept playing
soccer for Apoleh Haifa, played at national team of the country, until wounded
in 1939, became a coach/referee, kept working all his life as a welder in a
factory that was making oil and soap; Shemen in Haifa, worked until he died,
died at 59 from a sudden heart attack, he smoked a/half pack/day, worked
everyday, never talked to me about retiring, never go to the age of retirement,
don’t know what he would have done had he retired, I didn’t have a lot of long conversations
with him, b/c worked all day and spent vacationing working, building pipelines
of water, worked late hours to earn more money, quiet man
Family was working class
Mother born in Poland in 1914, came to Israel in
1937, worked at home as a seamstress, neither finished high school, girls
weren’t going to high school at that time, very intelligent, always went to
study in the evenings, courses, read books, inquisitive; died at 55, hit by a
car crossing the street; never talked about retirement
Siblings: 1 sister, 12 years younger, born in 1953,
teacher, with 3 children; when she was younger, I took care of her; when she
was baby, I took care of her, fed her, like a father; for first 2-3 years of
life but when got to high school, was busy with studying, didn’t have time for
her, I took high school very seriously, lived in small apartment together, but
then went to army, university, and didn’t see her much; distant relationship
now, not great, animosity, just developed, not sure why, because she is very
demanding, I used to spoil her as a child, bring her stuff and after my parents
died, I always helped her financially/presents, over the years, I didn’t feel
welcome at her house, the years went by and became more distant, less welcoming
and friendly, maybe something that changes with ages, she had animosity towards
me
Significant intimate relationships: Married
1966, 3 children, divorced 1979 legally; Married with your mom, 1981, 2
children
Children: 5 children: 38, 36, 31, 24, 21
Grandchildren: 1,
Darly, who is 3
Social
relationships
Friendships: I don’t have many friends, never made good
friends in the United States, I don’t know why, worked very hard; my friends
are mostly in Israel; initially made good friends, but they were mostly Israeli
and they went back to Israel; my good friends in Israel, some died already and
some are far away; one got sick and not himself…Zevi is brain damaged b/c had
surgery and brain didn’t get blood for awhile, he’s not himself; couldn’t find
a connection with Americans; b/c different culture; can’t have same connection,
different values/thinking, more materialistic, don’t share values of Judaism,
believe in Israel like I do, unique situation b/c immigrant, also more shy,
harder to get close with people, usually my spouse is my best friend; a little
shy in Israel, but grew up with people that became my friends; through my first
marriage, my wife was more social than me, opened doors for me, she made
friends very easily, then it was easy for to get into marriages, she was complementing
me; now, I don’t think I clicked with the people I met in this country, didn’t
develop into friendships; also b/c work and busy; so when I go to Israel, I
meet my good friends, more deep relationship; friends and family take up time,
don’t have time for hobbies, I work very hard; b/c one of reasons I came to
this country was to fulfill dream to do a lto of things in lfie…research, so
takes up a lot of my time
Social activities and involvements: I don’t
have any social activities; I just work and travel and write; do research;
only in Israel, visit friends, travel on
weekends, with other families with children, parties on Friday
first few years in America, more social, met
more people from Israel, bebfor emet mom was very social, only social with jewish
people, many Israeli friends in Rockville, visited them everyday b/c by my self
but after met mom, slowly stopped doing, and
went more few times a year to parties at her work, met lawyers, liked them, not
friendly
had children, again, very demanding, still took
care of other kids in summer, very demanding, so didn’t develop close
friendships and social things
friends with neighbors, but nothing extensive
Comparing of aging with peers:
Physically: I aged better than my peers, always
looked young, since teenager always looked younger than people, sort of
bothered me a little bit, after med school people didn’t think I was old enough
to be a doctor; I age okay; but as years went by, more medical problems;
physically, things that made me slow…injuries to my knees, couldn’t run since
1977, had surgery on my knee, had amiscus out, b/c tore it; slowly developed
pain in joints 10 years later; basically healthy until 6 months ago; didn’t
have major medical problems, although years having problems…prostate pain for
2.5 years and just went away, no problem with it anymore…cancer 6 months ago of
the throat
-over time became less energetic; I think I am
more energetic and active; but compared to myself, I notice changes in me all
the time, less active overall
I don’t exercise, other people around me, I
never liked; I don’t mind doing things for purpose, but to run for sake of run,
I don’t like
-I started to feel in last 10 years, that my
memory isn’t good, more forgetful, overwhelmed easier by tasks, migraines got worse/incapacitating
since I am 50, always had migraines but got worse
Psychologically and emotionally: I don’t know
how to care myself, I don’t know enough about them to compare
Some people are more active, like run and
exercise, but I just don’t like to do it
But as far working, I work harder; I am more
ambitious and have more dedication and I like what I am doing
My memory and comprehension of complicated
things aren’t as good…I was able to understand complicated things, read
something about work, sometimes I have to read 3-4 times in order to understand
or never understand; was very good at finding my way, like in traffic and maps;
it’s harder now b/c sometimes forget I read in the map where want to go so keep
on looking
-makes
me interrupt when talk to people b/c I am afraid I’ll forget it
-when
can’t understand, makes me upset, but I give up
-I
was really upset when first noticed it, when to hospital to get tested,
complained about it, doctors did a lot of test and found it’s true, but b/c I
am very intelligent I am above average of other people, but I lost some of my
capacities
-it
was very upsetting to accept it, but accept b/c there is nothing I can do about
it
-I say to myself it is age, and maybe b/c when
younger got injured, concussions of the brain, four concussions when in
20’s…hit my head on motorcycle accident 3 times, and yom kipper war wounded
-maybe it is showing it is effect
-adapt: write down more, do less complicated
things, write things down so don’t forget, I do things right away, finish it
right away, don’t stop until finish so won’t have to remember it right away,
don’t leave things for tomorrow so don’t have to remember; but I was always
worried about forgetting, but now that older, really feel it
-I forget names…it is embarrassing, I try to
get away with it, just say hi without mentioning their names; something I had
before, but it is worse; I just try and hide it, write down people’s names so
don’t forget
-I tested for alzheimers 10 years ago, not
worse, if I get it, there’s nothing can do about it; I noticed it 10 years ago,
I got used to it, doesn’t bother me anymore, I accept it
Leisure activities:
Hobbies and interests:
-no
-I like to fix broken things
-I used to paint until I was 18, I really liked
it, but I don’t have urge anymore, and don’t think im good as used to it, but
always say to myself that one day I’ll go back to
-I like art, painting, statues, architects,
look at buildings
-I liked sightseeing more when was younger;
would go to different cities to see as much as I could, but now I don’t do as
much, less exploring; I don’t leave enough time for it, I’m less interested
-I am less interested in driving; partially
don’t feel I am as good a driver as I used to be, I drive much slower, I am
more worried about accidents; I am much more careful than before, I obey all
traffic signs, slower; I feel that my instincts are not as good as they used to
be; and I can see a day when I say I am not driving anymore b/c not as good;
afraid of that but understand how people can get to age and say enough
-if go to different city, rather than walk and
drive; I’ll just stay in room and do some work; I noticed it more and more
-doesn’t mean don’t do it
-like listening to Israeli music and news,
keeps me connected to Israel
-I like seeing darly, but haven’t done it much
since I got to sick; b/c physically sick, tired, worn out, radiation for 7
weeks, side effects so last 6 months is like a dream; like a blurb of time,
fighting side effects of radiation, being tired, worn out, sleepy, not eating
much, losing weight, dealing with the cancer is a whole issue by itself
-confronting death, end of life, possibility
b/c always thought invincible, that nothing will happen to me, never had to
deal with my possibility of mortality
-only had to deal with 2 times before, during
war; 6 day war was dangerous, but very short, exposure to threat was minutes;
yom kippur war: much more dangerous, so I thought about death a lot
-then, never thought about
-didn’t feel like I was ready to die at 33,
didn’t feel like lived life yet
-but older I am, the more I am accepting it as
inevitable thing, but I never thought id have to deal with it now, so got used
to it, slowly
-I feel like I’ve done most important things in
life, try to do as much as possible, b/c believe that if I go to the world, I
want to leave it different, contribute, do something meaningful; felt I’ve done
a lot, but didn’t finish
-so when news about cancer, shock to me b/c
didn’t think it would happen so soon
-but on other hand, I was ready, thought about
a lot, did a lot of stuff, I accepted slowly my mortality over the years and
when first learned about the diagnosis, it was hard for about a day, but then
said it would be better than how my father died b/c would be sudden, no time to
prepare; if I die, time to prepare, psychologically, will, take care of kids; I
was also depressed, shocked; but after talked to doctors, and said prognosis
was very good, I decided that I am not going to stop, I will keep going; so I
started working and writing again, I became optimistic that will beat cancer
-I always felt like I am going to survive
dangers, lucky, always manage not to die…war, accidents; always did the right
thing
-I was afraid my luck had worn out, I couldn’t
believe it was me, I felt invincible
-I became optimistic b/c doctors told me 95%
chance of survival and I was a very good case for them to cure
-but I still have worry about it, but try to
stay optimistic
-in my case, also happened with upcoming
retirement from navy; supposed to retire at 65, and didn’t want to retire, even
before cancer, wanted to stay longer and not stop working
-but didn’t give me a chance to work longer,
extended me from 62-5, but won’t extend again
-that was hard, but accepted it; but then
cancer came, they postponed my retirement a little which is good b/c gives me
time to feel better, retire strong
-retirement is very hard for me, b/c it’s a
sign that it’s the end of my career, that won’t have a lab, won’t have to gt up
in the morning to go to war
-im not worried financially, financially I’ll
be fine
-im worried psychologically, will I have enough
to do, does it mean I can’t be productive anymore, until cancer came I felt
very very physically and mentally fit to keep working, im at peak of my career,
everything I do is really good professionally and I need to stop so that’s
upsetting, it’s like the world is telling me that it’s it
-on the one hand, I am accepting it and I don’t
want to start anywhere else; I feel like I am 65 and look at people 70 and they
look so old, so worn out, so unable to do anything; if this is how I’ll be, why
should I look for another job to work hard for 2 years and then be like this;
and say, who will want me; I don’t even apply for new jobs
-truth is, I am also sort of tired, even before
cancer
-no wish to start another career, became a
painter, see another part of country
-I don’t want to start something new; it’s not
like I’ve been waiting for this
-so what I tell myself: I’ll be very busy,
doing other things, I can write, teach, volunteer, I have more free time to see
my children and maybe go to Israel, granddaughter more, which is okay
-I am beginning to accept it that it’s going to
be okay to retire
-but if had choice, don’t want to retire, work
until last day of life, I like what I am doing, I like to work, do research in
the lab, look forward to going to work, really enjoy it, always come home late
-when did job to make money, counted down hours
to go home…moonlighting
-b/c what I do know, I do it b/c I like it,
sitting and writing a book, research
Travel: I traveled all over the world
-traveled a lot in Israel, walked a lot, hiked,
army, hiked 25 miles/day with equipment
-traveled in Europe 1965, hitchhiked for 3
months
-traveled in 1972 to Europe, Norway, Sweden
-traveled all over the u.s., liked to see
national parks, I love nature, parks
-then traveled all over the world giving
lectures, always made sure did lots of sightseeing, Indonesia, Phillipines,
korea, japan, India, Pakistan, Australia, Europe, been to every state in the
U.S. several times, never been to Alaska but will be there
Political interests: Just
vote
-in Israel, right wing…tough stand
-this country, I change; before cold war over,
voted for Reagan b/c I felt like he was tough with Russians
-always voted for president that got elected,
except for bush
-liberal in many ways, democratic other way
-but other ways tough, for death penalty,
pro-choice
-I am willing to listen
-but more dem than repub
-domestic: democratic, equal rights
-international: more tough with enemies,
republic, although not sure about bush, but at time was supported
Heatlh
Helath
status
-now, unknown, deal with side effects of
radiation, tumor hopefully gone, I want to be optimistic, but I am accepting my
mortality
-diagnosed late April, early May
-Diagnosis: hypopharygeal squamous cell
carcinoma; stage 1 meaning T1, L0, M0, meaning no metastasis, no lymph nodes, 1
is smallest possible tumor (1-4)
-removed the tumor, then gave me radiation for
7 weeks
-it’s very frustrating that now have to take
medication everyday; until 2 years ago, never took medication
-then one pill everyday for acid
-and now another pill everyday for thyroid
gland that has been damaged…1 in evening and morning, and shouldn’t forget it
-3 times a day for calcium, b/c age, not well
absorbed
-frustrating, but relatively small problems
-in many ways, lucky, got tumor early and know
medicine so I can detect things in me before other people would, and I am very
aggressive about seeking medical care, I go straight to doctor, no waiting
time; while other people not in my profession/navy, cannot get doctors to see
me right aw
-so optimistic
-siginficant effect: tired, very little saliva,
taste isn’t good but getting better, couldn’t taste food at all/awaful,
tiredness getting better
-everytime bend neck, electrical electricity in
legs, will last 6mos-1year…side effects, not big but just annoying
-it’s hard to do dialy life tasks/fuctioning,
so tired, don’t have energy to do them, hae to postpone things which si very
much not life me
-but better b/c getting thyroid back, have hypo
-getting replacement treatment so will be a few
more months and then will be okay
Current
perspective on what it’s like to be 65
-I never thought of myself as old, I feel at
heart very young
-Questions: I am asking myself if this is end,
are there other things I want to do, is this the end, do I have more time,
should I do more, but accepting that I wont
-when see people/places, I ask if I’ll see
it/them again, will I go back to San Fran, Israel, will I hae more time
-in past would say, sure; but now, I say I
don’t know; but accepting it, peace with my mortality, at peace with it but
still very hard to imagine it
-inside very optimistic
-I am happy that I’ve accepted my mortality,
end of road
-look at life like a bus ride, go through life
on bus, and then need to get off the bus, some people early, some people late…I
hope to stay in bus long…if have to get off early, it’s ok, I can’t accept it,
I don’t want to but I can accept
-I am happy there is an acceptance of life,
there’s a beginning and end; couldn’t deal with it as younger, very difficult
for me
-when close to death in yom kippur war, saw
people dying around me, knew could happen, wasn’t willing to accept it,
wouldn’t want it to happen, if happens now more at peace with it
-which I think is good, I don’t want it to
happen, but if it does, I can accept
-when look at people older than me, scares me
to see how incapcitated that they are, slowly, think/mve slowly, body fixed,
cane…don’t want to be like that; scares me that one day ill be like that b/c
inside don’t feel old; but I don’t want to die
-if I have to die one day, I am begging to
accept it But I also look at what it means to live longer, assuming cured from
cancer, that will have to get older and I don’t like wha ti see about older
people, slower, see old people in buses, malls; I pay attention, only 10 years
older than me, I realize there is a sharp decline, don’t know how I will feel
-stay alive
-stay happy, productive
-devote more time to more important things,
like family
-spending more time with family, children
Regrets about the past
-Yeah, many
-I wonder if I should have left Israel, was it
worth it, professionally it was, personally it wasn’t
-regret that my marriage didn’t work, divorce
and aftermath was most difficult thing in my life, affected psyche of 3 oldest
children…each traumatized…biggest regret, but unavoidable, maybe shouldn’t have
married her or made mistakes that led to divorce
-maybe shouldn’t have stayed in navy for 26 years,
gotten out earlier, done something else, go to work in a hospital, full time,
taken more care of patients, which I like
Significant changes
-biggest one, birth of Israel, lucky to see it,
watch how jewish people suddenly had state
-most significant thing in life was to become
Israeli soldier, never saw jews as soldiers before
-6 day war, suddenly going to see kotel in
Jerusalem
-fall of soviet union
-internet, computers terrific, changed
professional life, could do so much more
Proud
-that my children are able to do what they like
to do, follow their own dreams; some parents tell their children what do, I am
not, let everyone find what is best for them professionally
-proud in what I did to help Israel, went to
Israel and gave them course on radiation, if die now, I am okay, provide for
support/protection of Israel
-I have single-handedly changed medicine, did
research on what others didn’t do
-less children are sick and die…less children
have tonsils removed because of me, b/c found why penicillin does not work in
tonsillitis, found way to cure it by giving different medications
-did research on anaerobic infections in
children
-did research on radiation that can save people
after nuclear accidents, groundbreaking
-suffered from a lot of tonsil infections when
young, took it out/wasn’t pleasant, so don’t wan other kids to go through same
thing, prevent it from happening to others, can treat it with antibiotics
how feel about growing old
-accept it, but I don’t like ti, but accept it,
at peace with it
death
-don’t like it, but accept it
changes witnessed
-lucky to have experienced, seen it
-never thought would be able to see old city of
Jerusalem, wailing wall, never thought Russia would fall apart so world is
safer, never thought jews from Russia would come to Israel, it’s wonderful
younger generation
-I feel good, I feel like passing the baton,
that’s hwy I like so much to teach b/c now realize that people who are students
will be people who will run the world, they are going to do a good job
good about growing old
-get more experience, get more reasonable in my
case, more balance, less mistakes, used to maek more, more tolerant of other
people, I know im not always right b/c see mistakes I make, some ways more
rigid but other ways less, more rigid about my habits, but less rigid about
letting other people’s opinions and that I may be wrong, get to see my children
gorw, get a peak to the future, grandchildren, that’s fun, im lucky b/c my
father never got to do that, neither did my mother, I always feel bad they
never got to see their grandchildren, so I am lucky
-when I was young/18, would see woman 25, she
was old, wasn’t interested b/c just old woman
-the older I am, the more attractive I see
older women, more attractive even when older, because they are younger than me
-b/c more women that look attractive
-learned to be accepting of races, other days,
never found anything attractive about black people, less tolerant, now that
have black granddaughter…first thing that changed mind, jewish black people
from Ethiopia, realized race doesn’t matter…having black granddaughter,
completely blind…never bigot, but used to have differentiation…feel as close to
blacks as white people…always loved Sandra/marilyn as if was family. But having
part of you, really changed completely, but started with ethiopan jews
I am pleased, I adapt to reality, adapt to
getting odl, to inevitability of death, wasn’t easy when younger but accepting
it
